Author Topic: Does CM allow mixed racing fleets ?  (Read 3199 times)

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Offline Adrian

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Does CM allow mixed racing fleets ?
« on: January 22, 2007, 18:38:49 PM »
Is it correct that Classe Mini only "recognizes" mileage when no other classes are racing? 

If the Spanish, Italian or any other Mini Association organizes a race, in cooperation with another Club, and other boats race in their separate classes, can the Minis be granted mileage by their national association that is accepted by Classe Mini as credit towards a MT entry?

Adrian
« Last Edit: August 04, 2007, 12:09:34 PM by Leov »

Offline Atlantic Project

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2007, 19:22:17 PM »
Hi Adrian

 When racing MiniMax, miles are recognized and u sail among other boats in separate classes... so i don't see why casse mini france wouldn't grant other national classes what they grant to their own races.


 Pedro

Offline NathanBaron

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2007, 20:45:40 PM »
Is it correct that Classe Mini only "recognizes" mileage when no other classes are racing? 

If the Spanish, Italian or any other Mini Association organizes a race, in cooperation with another Club, and other boats race in their separate classes, can the Minis be granted mileage by their national association that is accepted by Classe Mini as credit towards a MT entry?

Adrian


Hi Adrian,

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but from reading the 2006 class rules I saw no other requiement other than the fact that it had to be a sanctioned CM event to count for MT miles.  I haven't read the minutes from the last AGM.  (I'm patiently wating for the 2007 version of the class rules, which are so nicely translated into english for us less than enlightened anglais.)

n

Offline Adrian

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2007, 21:25:25 PM »
Hi Nathan

Your reading is the same as mine. 

However, there is a possibility that "in practice" multi-class events have not always been recognized by Classe Mini for whatever reason & some people have come to believe that not recognizing multi class events has become an unwritten policy.

I do not think it is the case.  I am working on the assumption that when we know exactly what the requirements are for race management eg having a North American measurer on the W & E coasts, using the Classe Mini safety check lists, applying the stability tests for example, we will be able to negotiate a Mini class in larger events.

Adrian

Offline Ubik no more 245

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2007, 07:24:36 AM »
Hi,

as far as I know the mini max is the only race that is accepted by classemini and is a multi class race. It has something to do with the history of that race.
If you want to get a race classemini approved now, it has to be a race only for Minis.

I got this information from Annabelle.

Bye
Dominik

Offline Adrian

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2007, 18:41:51 PM »
Hi Dominik

Thanks for your post.  There always seems to be some kind of "twist" in our history & rules !!

We are hoping that with small fleets in North America we can get agreement from Classe Mini to recognise Mini classes in larger events.  Knowing that in Europe this has been the case on some occasions, is still the case with some races (Mini Max) may help our request.

Has anyone sailed in a European race in a Mini class & been recognized by Classe Mini?

Offline Ubik no more 245

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2007, 19:26:48 PM »
Hi Adrian,

as far as I know, the only classemini recognized races are the ones in France and Italy (they got their own recognized classemini Italy) and the mini barcelona in spain.

Bye Dominik

Offline Adrian

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2007, 20:12:13 PM »
Hi Dominik,

Thank you.

That makes sense to me - France with the largest number of Minis and home for the Int Classe Association has Mini only races & other countries (italy & Spain), as the Mini fleets & associations are growing, have Classe Mini recognized fleets in larger events.  That would make great sense for us in Canada & the US.

What is happening in Germany & Norway?  Can someone tell us?

Thanks,

Adrian

Offline Ubik no more 245

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2007, 20:50:54 PM »
Hi Adrian,

you understood that not right. The races in Italy and Spain are also races exclusive for Minis. In Germany we try to get Minis racing, this season it seems to be possible that we get a Mini ranking in some events. But none of these races will be recognized by the class.
In Norway the progress is good. I think they have several doublehanded races there Minis can start. But it is the same there, no special race for minis and no recognition by the classemini.

Bye
Dominik

Offline NicoG

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2007, 17:12:07 PM »
Recognition by the Classe,
you make proposal for MT, you provide tickets and hotel for measurement guy and one of the MT girls. There  must be a yacht club involved with Isaf recognition or something like that.
And done.

Of course you need the depth gauge and some lead (both cheap and easy to make, but you need storage for it).
« Last Edit: August 04, 2007, 11:57:02 AM by Leov »

Offline Atlantic Project

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2007, 17:38:13 PM »
Hi all.

 We are having a high growing rate here in spain... form 1 mini in 1999 to more than 40 nowadays. Still not organized as we would like ( working on it... maybe association this year ) last year we had Mini Barcelona, this year we'll have Mini Taylor Woodrow from 16 to 22 of April in Pollença ( 280 miles around Mallorca & Menorca islands)... yesss!! new race in mediterranean recognized by Classe Mini. At the same time we are allowed in a few major events in wich we race under classe Mini Rules ( almost i mean... as nobody checks ) though among Irc, Ims and Rn classes; for instance Regata Ophiusa, 161 miles from Sitges to Formentera Island ( 5th of April ), La  Petrolera, 80 miles, Mataro-Roses 78 miles...

 Things are on the move and i suppose we'll have plenty more races in a couple of years ( at least in Spain )... just the time organizers will take to realize we are a major force in races and there's market for us.

 Pedro
« Last Edit: January 25, 2007, 01:32:13 AM by Atlantic Project »

Offline Adrian

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2007, 01:04:58 AM »
Hi all,

Dominik, Thanks for your reply.  Has the German Mini fleet applied to Classe Mini to have races in larger events recognized?  If Classe Mini said NO what reasons id they give?  I visited your website, it was good to have the English translation - thanks a lot.  I live only 30 miles from one of your ex crew members Dan Ohms.  I hope he will buy a Mini one day & help build the fleet here.

Leo, it will be expensive to fly a CM rep to San Francisco but who knows we may be able to get a free ticket from an airline.  How can one become a CM measurer - do we beg, plead or make an argument we meed a trained measurer on the E & W coatst of N America.

Pedro - great to hear from you too.  Your experience in Spain sounds positive in getting Classe Mini recognition for races - what do you think are the most important pointes to emphasize in a proposal - is having a measuremet person the most important?  Safety check lists or ??   Hope to see you this Spring.

Is the problem of boat measurement an issue mainly for Protos & new sails?  The Series boats will have a certificate , do they need to be re-measured?  Cannot any sail measurer check dimensions & sail materials.  Do they all have to be Classe Mini trained persons?

Adrian

Offline Ubik no more 245

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2007, 07:34:05 AM »
Hi Adrian,

in Germany we did not try to get a race classemini recognized. We might do that later but not for this year. But I asked Annabelle at the AG in Paris and she said that it is not possible to get a race recognized if it is not a race only for Minis.
Do you know Dan? I had a good time doing with him the Demi Cle. He teached me much about lightwind sailing.

Bye Dominik

Offline NicoG

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2007, 10:43:31 AM »
Of course you can ask MT about it :) maybe they will make an exception for the US.
And you need experience in how to measure before you do it yourself.
So or you send your measurer to Eu to learn the tricks, or get him over to US.
Just my thinking...

THe CM had in the past some bad experience with the Italians, they measured boats, came racing in France, and the were not exactly in the rules :)
« Last Edit: January 25, 2007, 10:52:36 AM by Leov »

Offline Atlantic Project

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Re: Mini Class Entries in Larger Races
« Reply #14 on: January 25, 2007, 19:29:49 PM »
Adrian:

 If u want a CM race it has to be all easy, everything arranged in advance don't stress them... Leov is right, bring'em the means and they will be delighted to go to US... at the end, that's what they are for isn't it?

 Pedro
« Last Edit: January 25, 2007, 19:50:30 PM by Atlantic Project »