what about an open source proto design?

[NicoG]

What are your thoughts about a colaboration design of a proto 650 open to everyone... no copyrights, can be built and tuned as pleased!
who is up for the creation of the first open source Mini 650??

[sideburns]

As far as I remember there used to be a OS Mini development several yers ago... Someone here should know.

[Thomas]

I have some dark recollection of an OS design somewhere, somehow, but...

In any case I think this is an interesting idea. But to break this down:

The "open source" concept could extend to all parts of the boat, including:
- hull
- deck
- appendages
- mast/spars

Now we have a problem here: What we would do with an "open source" design is sort of settling on a concept for each of those pieces. Obviously nobody would need to adhere to any of these, but then again, what would the "open source" design actually try to accomplish? Reducing the preliminiary design work? Providing a platform with a supposedly good performance to start from? And where does it go from there?

I'm still trying to think this through, but I think the diversity in approaches to Minis and the millions of possible solutions to a certain design brief make me wonder whether it's worth the energy invested.

[NicoG]

My thought was having a good basic package for anyone to pick up and build or to improve and make their own boat.

The OS Mini must offer a full package. Hull/Deck/Appendages/Sailplan and main structure.

The Open Source design would allow for a fast improvement on a low budget based on contribution. Basically anyone picking the design should be willing to contribute and show their modifications and evolution.

Its true that there are many approaches to a Mini 650 but so to anything else .... by contribution the project will have thousand of hours of design and evaluation something that a Mini 650 project doesnt allow and this would be a direct result in performance.

Unfortunately, all this is based on contribution and it doesnt seem like a lot of people is willing to chip in!

[jo]

Hi,
there was an OS approach in the year 2000 by Hans Zwackenberg. Unfortunately they didn't get beyond some preliminary plans.
http://www.mini-650.de/index.html
http://38965.forumromanum.com/member/forum/forum.php?action=std_tindex&USER=user_38965&threadid=2

BR jo

[Thomas]

Hi jo,
Thanks for digging that up. I knew I'd seen it somewhere...

Unfortunately those data obviously are 8 years old by now at least, and looking at the hull form, pretty outdated. Not sure whether this ever led far. But maybe Mr Zwackenberg and his contributors would be interested in getting their foot back into this?


Nico,
I think willingness for contribution is a bit of trouble here, really, as it seems to be a huge project and we'd certainly need an idea of what needs to be done, how much time each part of it would take etc etc before there are more people willing to say "oh, I've got those hours on my hand, I think I should get into this".

[NicoG]

Hi,

sorry for my late reply... work is keeping me busy.
From my point of view this would only be interesting if someone would actually do something with the work done... if there was a basic boat which could be build by amateurs that would get some people closer to their fist boat; the design must be competitive.
I fear there is not a lot of will to make such thing reality...

[Thomas]

If "who will use it?" is the main problem, then yes, we're in for a bit of trouble... it's a full sized boat after all!

[Ubik no more 245]

Hi,
I actually think there is so little response to this topic because buying a plan from a well known designer is not the problem. Why try an open source design if the right plans are available on the market for ok pricing?
I do not believe the plan contributes a lot to the total price of building a new proto.

For a first boat the cheapest way is to buy an older proto. They are cheap to get in the moment. So why build something on your own if you can get a proven boat for way cheaper than the own build? The first boat will anyhow (most probably) not be one you will win with.

For me personally an open source mast design would be more helpful. Carbon Masts are expensive and somehow they need regular exchange. All the cheap protos have an old carbon mast that would need to be exchanged sooner or later but the cost for that is nearly as high as the boat price. I personally have no clue how to build a mast but I guess I am not the only one seeing the carbon mast as a major cost driver for older boats.

Dominik